This question was closed without grading. Reason: Otra razón
Jun 6, 2019 22:08
4 yrs ago
2 viewers *
español term
el tuteo
español al inglés
Arte/Literatura
Poesía y literatura
Preferiría evitar 'translator's note' a pie de página, no tener que explicar la cosa...
La frase en cuestión:
Durante años y años, Alberto y ella habían mantenido una relación superficialmente cariñosa, que se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo y sólo en contadas ocasiones dejaba entrever una solidaridad algo más profunda.
La frase en cuestión:
Durante años y años, Alberto y ella habían mantenido una relación superficialmente cariñosa, que se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo y sólo en contadas ocasiones dejaba entrever una solidaridad algo más profunda.
Proposed translations
(inglés)
Proposed translations
+5
8 minutos
casualness/familiarity
...in the threshold of casualness/familiarity/informality...
Peer comment(s):
agree |
JohnMcDove
: That's the concept. Maybe "excessive informality"?
58 minutos
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Gracias, John, "excessive informality" suena bien. Saludos :)
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agree |
Beatriz Ramírez de Haro
1 hora
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Gracias, Beatriz :)
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agree |
franglish
8 horas
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Gracias, franglish :)
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agree |
Stuart and Aida Nelson
: creo que para la frase es adecuada tu traducción y yo usaría 'informality' como sugirió John, mira la discusión, saludos, Aida:)
8 horas
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¡No sabía eso del alemán! Parece que la opción "informality" es la más elegida. Gracias, Aida :)
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agree |
Cecilia Gowar
: ¨on the verge of informality¨I would say...
9 horas
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Gracias, Cecilia. "Informality" parecería ser la mejor opción. Saludos :)
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+3
9 minutos
to refer/adress/refering/adressing each other by name/on a first name basis/dropping formal protocol
Two alternatives. An affirmative and a negative one, both regarding those instances when formality was almost discarded in their relationship.
I Hope it helps.
I Hope it helps.
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Helena Chavarria
: In UK English we say 'on first-name terms'.
9 minutos
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True. First name basis is American English and that should be taken into account.
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agree |
JohnMcDove
: who stopped with spontaneous discretion at the threshold of the "excessive familiarity"/dealing with each other on a first name terms/basis/ and only on rare occasions did a deeper solidarity appear.
1 hora
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agree |
Stuart and Aida Nelson
: agree with dropping formal protocol
8 horas
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42 minutos
being on first-name terms with
My opinion.
+1
1 hora
calling each other (by the familiar) "tu".
I don't think you should try to find other ways of saying this. "Being on first-name terms" doesn't work, since that's how most people speak to one another in English-speaking cultures.
You could possibly leave out the bit in parentheses. A lot of educated people will understand the differences between formal and informal pronouns if they've studied any Spanish or French.
You could possibly leave out the bit in parentheses. A lot of educated people will understand the differences between formal and informal pronouns if they've studied any Spanish or French.
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Juan Jacob
: Bueno, sí, pero "tú", en todo caso, no "tu", que es otra cosa.
¡Tú dices!
1 hora
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Will you agree with me if I spell it right? :-)
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agree |
Stuart and Aida Nelson
: agree with you, I have never heard of anyone saying being on first-name terms. That is kind of implied in English since that is the way most people speak in English and yes, your typo doesn't matter, we know you meant tú, Cheers, Aida
7 horas
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8 horas
informal manner to address someone (informal register)
The Formal and Informal Manner to Address Someone
One of the more obvious cultural differences in Germany for speakers of the English language is the formal way of speaking to strangers, acquaintances and business colleagues. The German language makes a clear distinction between people who are family and good friends and those who are not by using Sie and du in place of the English you. First names are only used with family, friends and children. In all other situations, people address each another by their last names.
https://www.fidelio-relocation.de/en/faq/living/formal-and-i...
These sentences are not as uncommon as you may think. In languages where you have both formal and informal registers (German and Spanish) , sometimes you just have to ask/tell people what to use.
https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/5859788/How-would-someone...
+1
8 horas
familiarity
Could be an option... referring to superficial familiarity between the interlocutors
los umbrales del tuteo = the threshold of famiiarity
los umbrales del tuteo = the threshold of famiiarity
Reference:
http://espanolsinmisterios.blogspot.com/2012/09/tu-usted-vos-o-su-merced-problemas-con.html
1 día 1 hora
español term (edited):
que se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo
which occasionally almost took on a more casual tone
Another take on it. From the passage posted I can only determine that their “relationship” is first and foremost a “formal” one (work colleagues?), so I’d be inclined to spell that out in the first part of the sentence and take it from there.
Here’s my understanding of the passage, and how I might translate it:
“[…] habían mantenido una relación superficialmente cariñosa, que se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo y sólo en contadas ocasiones dejaba entrever una solidaridad algo más profunda.”
“[…] had [had] a formal relationship with [name], which occasionally almost took on a more casual tone, but rarely managed to reveal any sort of deeper friendship.”
_________________
Hope it helps.
Here’s my understanding of the passage, and how I might translate it:
“[…] habían mantenido una relación superficialmente cariñosa, que se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo y sólo en contadas ocasiones dejaba entrever una solidaridad algo más profunda.”
“[…] had [had] a formal relationship with [name], which occasionally almost took on a more casual tone, but rarely managed to reveal any sort of deeper friendship.”
_________________
Hope it helps.
Discussion
https://www.academia.edu/18952426/El_voseo_en_el_español_Gua...
En cuanto que el primero se use sólo para el género masculino, creo que estás confundido.
Te copio algunos fragmentos de un documento que trata del tema:
¨En alguos países, el pronombre vos ha reemplazado al tú
casi completamente, pero en Guatemala todavía coexisten los dos pronombres.
......
En general, la selección del pronombre de segunda persona se determina en base a muchos factores formalidad o informalidad de la situación, el contexto, los pensamientos o sentimientos de los interlocutores, autoridad, generación, edad, posición social, etc.)
...............
En el tiempo de su estudio, la autora *descubrió que el uso del voseo
predominaba entre los varones. De hecho, los hombres entrevistados indicaron que el uso de tú era una señal de afeminación u homosexualidad cuando se usaba entre hombres. Los hombres de este estudio afirmaron que el
tuteo debería ser apartado para conversaciones con mujeres, especialmente conversaciones entre mujeres.¨
* Se refiere a un estudio realizado por Anne Pinkerton en la segunda mitad del siglo pasado, en un sector de la población.
Regarding the use of ¨usted¨ in this story, well, the time seems to be around 1960 and yes, it would be possible for someone to address an in-law as ¨usted¨in some circumstances: older person, more important from the social or professional point of view, etc.
I did read the whole story because when possible I like to have the wider context. I do not know if I am allowed to publish the link here, should someone be interested?
I didn't know these two were related by marriage; it doesn't say so in the question.
As for what is happening here, "se detenía con espontánea discreción en los umbrales del tuteo" must mean that they don't actually call each other "tú" but come close to doing so.
In the area around Barnsley, in Yorkshire, people still call family and close friends "thou" (pronounced "tha"). You can hear it in Ken Loach's wonderful film Kes.