| Páginas sobre el tema: < [1 2] | Working in Germany Autor de la hebra: Will Kelly
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Dan Lucas 
Reino Unido
Local time: 22:13
Miembro 2014
japonés al inglés
Thomas T. Frost wrote:
But I can work anywhere, so why would I pay ten times more to live near a city? Annual property tax: €240 plus services (refuse collection, water etc.). I still have three supermarkets within 1 km and another three if I'm willing to drive 3 kms more. I have an international airport within one hour's driving. I can make do with driving 3,000 kms a year.
Fantastic. I enjoyed city life when I was single and in my 20s, but those days are gone. Now I'm happy to live out in the sticks. My nearest airport is much further away than yours is though.
And if the building needs work, well, the difference between what you paid and the 6-figure sum you'd have had to pay in the UK for anything like the same size should pay for a lot of refurbishment...
Dan
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Patrick.D wrote:
What is the point in comparing property prices of the former East Germany with the UK? I would more likely compare land prices of the old GDR with land prices of the old West Germany. Aren't Germans fleeing the eastern states of Germany for the western states?
The point is to illustrate a low-cost housing option.
If you want property prices elsewhere in Germany, you'll find them on http://www.immobilienscout24.de/ .
No, Germans aren't fleeing the eastern states, but there was a migration in western direction until recently. That has more or less stopped, though, and some are now moving in the other direction. Unemployment is still higher in the east than west.
The obvious reason for moving west is jobs. As a freelance translator, one does not need to move for jobs, so where others are moving is irrelevant.
Seen as a whole, German real estate is still statistically undervalued in relation to income levels, whereas they are overvalued in the UK and France.
| | | | | Limited Company? | Jan 11, 2016 |
Are you planning to continue to operate as an employee of your Limited Company in the UK or are you planning on closing that company and becoming a German "Freiberufler" (= status as a member of the liberal professions, which has significant tax implications)? I would think that the first option is possible (UK corporate tax and German income tax and public insurance fees), but I have no idea if this strategy developed to avoid paying British taxes would still make sense if you relocated to Germ... See more Are you planning to continue to operate as an employee of your Limited Company in the UK or are you planning on closing that company and becoming a German "Freiberufler" (= status as a member of the liberal professions, which has significant tax implications)? I would think that the first option is possible (UK corporate tax and German income tax and public insurance fees), but I have no idea if this strategy developed to avoid paying British taxes would still make sense if you relocated to Germany.
I would think that dividends are taxed at a maximum of 25% (or less, if your income tax rate is lower) and that they are not taken into account in determining the level of your payments for public health, insurance and retirement insurance, but I don't know. It is also possible that what may already be some fairly creative accounting in the UK qualifies as tax evasion in Germany.
At any rate, the equation for your total tax burden and total cost of living in the UK relative to Germany is extremely complex. The German government will pay you close to 400 euros per month if both of your children are still minors living at home. If you or your wife is an employee, it will also contribute over 1000 euros per year (for both of you together, not each of you individually) towards a supplementary retirement fund (Riesterrente). Universities are essentially free here, childcare is incredibly inexpensive when compared to the US (I have no idea of the situation in the UK), at least if you own a condominium/flat, property tax is essentially non-existent in Germany (I don't know about the situation with a single-family home/detached house).
Governments gather the funds they need in entirely different ways and I think that the only thing you can do is to sit down with your bank and tax statements and talk with family or friends of your wife with a similar family and career situation in Germany with their bank and tax statements, form an overview and then get in touch with a German accountant (Steuerberater) to see what you haven't thought of. ▲ Collapse
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Will Kelly wrote:
... ‘freiberuflich’ category (broadly: a freelancer), and that 15-16% would go on health insurance, another 2.35% on elderly care insurance, and 18% on state pension (voluntary for people who are freiberuflich, but probably advisable). That’s already 36% of gross income (not net)!
Really, are you sure about those contibutions being calculated on gross income? I find that surprising...
And let me get this right, you don't pay into national insurance at all with your current set-up? Why even think about moving to Germany then... just move to a cheaper area in the UK!
Have you seen the information here? http://www.proz.com/forum/money_matters/140264-tax_rate_for_freiberufler.html
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| What is your N°1 reason for moving? | Jan 11, 2016 |
Is it this one?
Will Kelly wrote:
We want to move abroad because house prices in the UK are insane.
If so, it would appear that moving anywhere cheaper would be a good move, within the UK preferably so nothing else changes.
Or is this the main reason?
My partner wants to return to Germany.
In which case, maybe you should be thinking of moving there at all costs. Isn't the happiness of your family worth paying for? I tried it myself, going from two well-paid full-time salaries in the London rat-race to one part-time freelancing income among the vineyards of France, cutting down trees to keep warm in winter. We spent practically zero for several years, not even a coffee in a bar, living off the meagre interest on the balance left from our house sale/purchase. Our son only benefitted from the change, as did we, his parents.
And an idea, which may not be at all appropriate in your circumstances but maybe worth a thought:
Due to ongoing health issues, I work part time, and so I’m not paying much tax at all. My partner doesn’t currently work as she’ll be a full-time mother for at least another year or so.
If you're at home much of the time, perhaps you should be thinking of becoming a full-time father, with help from outside as and when required by your health issues. Then your partner can take on a full-time salaried or freelance position, and you can take up your freelance translation again once circumstances permit. That way, you could afford life in Germany with no problem.
Only you know what's best for you and yours, but is money really the N°1 factor?
| | | | Will Kelly
Reino Unido
neerlandés al inglés
PERSONA QUE INICIÓ LA HEBRA | Thanks again for the further info! | Jan 11, 2016 |
I’ve only got a few minutes to spare this evening (just finished work!). I’ve read all points, taken them on board, and want to thank you all. Here are some hasty responses to some of them:
Buying elsewhere in the UK isn’t something I’m keen on. House prices are vastly overvalued here, and even though the problem is worse in popular regions/locations, it’s all relative. I’m also concerned that there is really nothing left to prop up the silly prices – the government h... See more I’ve only got a few minutes to spare this evening (just finished work!). I’ve read all points, taken them on board, and want to thank you all. Here are some hasty responses to some of them:
Buying elsewhere in the UK isn’t something I’m keen on. House prices are vastly overvalued here, and even though the problem is worse in popular regions/locations, it’s all relative. I’m also concerned that there is really nothing left to prop up the silly prices – the government has even resorted to doling out taxpayers’ money now (Help to Buy ISA). With the UK’s current account position, we are more exposed to economic headwinds from abroad now, and what with the problems with oil, commodities and now stock markets, etc. and new conditions coming in to make things less attractive for buy-to-let landlords, there is a real risk of a sharp fall in property prices. Which would be fine if I were to buy after such a fall, but not before. I’d rather buy in a country where prices are already sane, again based on average house price and average wage.
Health care in the UK is, of course, covered by National Insurance (which is just another form of tax), but I only pay about £1/quarter, due to the accounting set-up I’ve described above.
Whether or not I keep my ltd in the UK and be a resident of Germany working for that company or else become a Freiberufler in Germany is the tricky question. I can’t see a straightforward answer. The ‘creative accounting’ is not all that creative. The system allows one to set up a ltd, pay 20% corporation tax and pay oneself a very modest wage that covers one’s personal allowance but no more (ergo no income tax liability) and yet enough to have to pay a few pounds NI, qualifying for state pension, etc. I’m operating entirely within the letter and spirit of the law.
I can’t consider being a full-time father. My partner has been a full-time mother for 8 years now, and she wasn’t highly qualified/experienced prior to that, so her earning potential isn’t high. I’ve comfortably managed to support us all in the meantime. It’s not all about money, but the change in the exchange rate is significant. Ultimately the standard of living is better in Germany, much as the Germans love to moan about things only being 90% perfect. My German girlfriend, who has lived in the UK for 16 years, thinks all Germans should be obliged to come to the UK for a year and see how good they actually have it.
We would also consider moving to the Netherlands if this is even more favourable. House prices there seem reasonable at last, though they’ve started to climb again after about 8 years of stagnation. We’ve lived there before, and I have no problems with the language (it’s my professional language). And from anywhere in the Randstad area it’s only an hour or so to the border. ▲ Collapse
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