Post-editing MT (was "Future has become a terrifying present") Autor de la hebra: monica.m
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monica.m
Italia
Local time: 14:43
Miembro 2011
alemán al italiano
+ ...
Excerpt from an PEMT job "offer":
"Only new words (from Google Translate) and matches up to and including 99% require post-editing. Perfect Matches, Context Matches, and repetitions to do require post-editing.
Post-editing rates will be based on per 1,000 words basis, not hourly."
Editing of Google Translated "translation" is this what we are expected to do?
For post-editing rates?
| | | | Maija Cirule 
Letonia
Local time: 15:43
alemán al inglés
+ ...
| And so what? | Mar 28, 2015 |
dsd-sl wrote:
Excerpt from an PEMT job "offer":
"Only new words (from Google Translate) and matches up to and including 99% require post-editing. Perfect Matches, Context Matches, and repetitions to do require post-editing.
Post-editing rates will be based on per 1,000 words basis, not hourly."
Editing of Google Translated "translation" is this what we are expected to do?
For post-editing rates?
Somebody offers you this "job" and you reject the offer. Simples. You are not forced at gunpoint to accept anything that is offered to you.
| | | | Theo Bernards (X)
Francia
Local time: 14:43
inglés al neerlandés
+ ...
| Not only that, ... | Mar 28, 2015 |
Maija Cirule wrote:
Somebody offers you this "job" and you reject the offer. Simples. You are not forced at gunpoint to accept anything that is offered to you.
... you can always try negotiate a rate that suits you before walking away. I actually offer PEMT, for a rate that lies between my per source word translation rate and my per word proofreading rate. I have clients who are happy to take me up on it, even after I tell them that the result will in most cases be inferior to a proper translation.
| | | | vonflauschig (X)
Alemania
Local time: 14:43
inglés al alemán
+ ...
| I think it was meant in a different way | Mar 28, 2015 |
dsd-sl wrote:
Excerpt from an PEMT job "offer":
"Only new words (from Google Translate) and matches up to and including 99% require post-editing. Perfect Matches, Context Matches, and repetitions to do require post-editing.
Post-editing rates will be based on per 1,000 words basis, not hourly."
Editing of Google Translated "translation" is this what we are expected to do?
For post-editing rates?
I think he is more about: what has happened to our occupation? What is translation today? I also get more and more offers to post-edit a google translation, where the clients thinks it is easier and cheaper than having it translated by a professional.
The question that needs to be asked here is: is editing such a translator any easier than writing the text from scratch? Well, I'm not so sure about it. These google "translations" require more work than translation itself, since it is very rarely only about "post-editing" - the meaning is lost, grammar and the terms, too.
And I do find it terrifying. This leads to a situation, where we, translators, get compared to a machine and what we really do, gets lost.
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Maija Cirule
Letonia
Local time: 15:43
alemán al inglés
+ ...
| I have appr. 20 more or less regular clients | Mar 28, 2015 |
vonflauschig wrote:
dsd-sl wrote:
Excerpt from an PEMT job "offer":
"Only new words (from Google Translate) and matches up to and including 99% require post-editing. Perfect Matches, Context Matches, and repetitions to do require post-editing.
Post-editing rates will be based on per 1,000 words basis, not hourly."
Editing of Google Translated "translation" is this what we are expected to do?
For post-editing rates?
I think he is more about: what has happened to our occupation? What is translation today? I also get more and more offers to post-edit a google translation, where the clients thinks it is easier and cheaper than having it translated by a professional.
The question that needs to be asked here is: is editing such a translator any easier than writing the text from scratch? Well, I'm not so sure about it. These google "translations" require more work than translation itself, since it is very rarely only about "post-editing" - the meaning is lost, grammar and the terms, too.
And I do find it terrifying. This leads to a situation, where we, translators, get compared to a machine and what we really do, gets lost.
and only one of them some time ago offered me a "post-editing" job and I rejected it. I translate mostly medical and legal texts, maybe due to this fact my clients don't have a craze for Google translations.
| | | | | I have a good number of | Mar 28, 2015 |
long term clients (both translation agencies and direct clients). My clents don't care for Google Translate and the like. I have been asked twice to post-edit a machine translation and I rejected it.
| | | | Dan Lucas
Reino Unido
Local time: 13:43
Miembro 2014
japonés al inglés
dsd-sl wrote:
is this what we are expected to do?
Don't take this kind of job. Move on.
Dan
[Edited at 2015-03-28 14:34 GMT]
| | | | Alex Lago
España
Local time: 14:43
inglés al español
+ ...
| Google Logic | Mar 28, 2015 |
For most people (who only speak one language) it goes like this:
A. Google is a company that provides good products
B. Google provides Google Translate
C. Google Translate must be a good product
D. Why should I pay for something Google does for free
For people who speak other languages or understand the limitations of MT:
A. Google is a company that provides good products
B. Google provides Google Translate
C. Well everyone mak... See more For most people (who only speak one language) it goes like this:
A. Google is a company that provides good products
B. Google provides Google Translate
C. Google Translate must be a good product
D. Why should I pay for something Google does for free
For people who speak other languages or understand the limitations of MT:
A. Google is a company that provides good products
B. Google provides Google Translate
C. Well everyone makes mistakes
D. Thank God I can pay a professional translator to get this content translated ▲ Collapse
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| Compose a standard letter of explanation | Mar 28, 2015 |
I work with a handful of clients who are seriously working on machine translation - NOT Google! I simply refuse to post-edit or have anything to do with Google Translate.
What you can do is write an explanation of why you don't do it, and have it ready to attach or cut and paste into answers to these requests.
Point out that it takes longer than human translation from scratch (using a Translation Memory CAT where appropriate). So of course you need to be paid for your ... See more I work with a handful of clients who are seriously working on machine translation - NOT Google! I simply refuse to post-edit or have anything to do with Google Translate.
What you can do is write an explanation of why you don't do it, and have it ready to attach or cut and paste into answers to these requests.
Point out that it takes longer than human translation from scratch (using a Translation Memory CAT where appropriate). So of course you need to be paid for your time.
You have to check the garbage against the source, decide it is inadequate, and THEN start translating, so it is not just something translators imagine when they say it takes longer.
Remind clients that there may also be issues with confidentiality.
Add other reasons if you like, shortly and concisely.
Simply educate the client. Translation is not like a sculpture where you begin with a rough block and whittle out details. It is like a painting, where every brush stroke has to be accurate from the start. Mistakes have to cleaned away and re-worked, so it is fastest to get translation accurate from the start. GT is more hindrance than help!
WE are the professionals, so WE explain to clients what we will or will not do to provide the best possible translation for them. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Thayenga
Alemania
Local time: 14:43
Miembro 2009
inglés al alemán
+ ...
| Google Translate | Mar 29, 2015 |
IMHO a translator of good standing stays clear of not only Google Translate but also from post-editing its, at times hilarious, output.
[Edited at 2015-03-29 16:41 GMT]
| | | | monica.m
Italia
Local time: 14:43
Miembro 2011
alemán al italiano
+ ...
PERSONA QUE INICIÓ LA HEBRA | It was not an offer to me | Mar 29, 2015 |
It was not an offer to me, it was just a Proz job post from a big agency.
I just wonderd if this was a sort of trend...
| | | | Maija Cirule
Letonia
Local time: 15:43
alemán al inglés
+ ...
| This must be a | Mar 29, 2015 |
dsd-sl wrote:
It was not an offer to me, it was just a Proz job post from a big agency.
I just wonderd if this was a sort of trend...
Bigmouth or what's its name type agency, not a serious one.
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Samuel Murray
Países Bajos
Local time: 14:43
Miembro 2006
inglés al afrikaans
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| Base your rate on the MT engine | Mar 30, 2015 |
dsd-sl wrote:
Editing of Google Translated "translation" is this what we are expected to do? For post-editing rates?
Well, editing is supposed to be paid per hour, right? Therefore, if it is paid per word, then the rate should be determined by how good or how bad the translation is.
If the translator whose work you should edit is a good translator, you can offer a low per-word rate and still make a lot of money per hour. But if the translator is a bad translator, then you should offer a higher per-word rate, so that you don't risk making less than your required minimum per hour.
The same would apply to PEMT -- if the MT engine is generic, non-learning and non-customisable (and/or: bad), then your per-word rate should simply be higher.
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