Saint Kitts and Nevis

French translation: Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (UN context)

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

English term or phrase:	Saint Kitts and Nevis
French translation:	Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (UN context)
Entered by:	Taña Dalglish

17:39 Sep 15, 2012

English to French translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - International Org/Dev/Coop / Official UN listing of countries

English term or phrase: Saint Kitts and Nevis

Dear colleagues:

I am proofing/editing a document originally written in English and translated to French. It is UN-specific:

My question does not relate to the translation of Saint Kitts and Nevis, per say, which is "Saint Christophe-et-Niévès" (i.e. many use this). However, according to the official list of countries here: http://unstats.un.org/unsd/geoinfo/ungegn/docs/26th-gegn-doc...
what the UN uses is "Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis"

Original English context:
The course was attended by x participants from the 7 English-speaking xx countries (Antigua and Barbuda, Grenada, Jamaica, St. Kitts and Nevis, St. Lucia, St. Vincent and the Grenadines, and The Bahamas) and the host country. Follow-up training proposals are currently being implemented through small grants awarded to each country.

French:
x personnes venues de 7 pays anglophones du Défi Caraïbes (Antigua-et-Barbuda, Grenade, Jamaïque, **Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (ou Saint Christophe-et-Niévès)***, Sainte-Lucie, Saint-Vincent-et-les-Grenadines, et les Bahamas) et du pays d'accueil ont participé à cette formation. Des propositions de formation de suivi sont actuellement mises en œuvre grâce aux petites subventions accordées à chaque pays.

I want to ensure that the link I included is the most up-to-date usage, and the norm has not changed.

I welcome any suggestions.

Thank you.

Taña Dalglish KudoZ activity Questions: 77 (none open) (6 closed without grading) Answers: 4327 Jamaica
Local time: 16:00

Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis

Explanation:
Yes, I would go with this translation, considering where you are located and the following note :
« Les Nations Unies retiennent le nom que le pays membre dénommé est lui-même invité à déposer en français comme dans chacune des cinq autres langues officielles de l'ONU. Dans le cas présent, ce dernier nom, soit « Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis », propose une francisation partielle du nom, alors que l’usage courant français adapte totalement le nom à sa langue (traduction et prononciation). »
http://www.toponymiefrancophone.org/DivFranco/Bougainville/R...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 mins (2012-09-15 17:50:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Source : groupe d'experts des Nation Unies pour les nombs géographiques - division francophone

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 mins (2012-09-15 17:56:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Pardon!!!

Source: Groupe d'experts des Nations Unies pour les noms géographiques - division francophone

Again, according to them, « Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès » is exclusively used in France: « L'autorité française retient le nom d'usage courant en France. »
« Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis » is used at the United Nations and in Canada.

It all depends what your target public is.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 44 mins (2012-09-15 18:23:50 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Answer to asker (below):
My source is the UN, so I believe it directly applies to your situation (UN's current norm). I was talking of target public to account for the fact that Alain's answer isn't wrong (it would work if the target public were French).

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 50 mins (2012-09-15 18:30:11 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

They are the official toponomy expert group of the UN:
http://www.toponymiefrancophone.org/DivFranco/Bougainville/R...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 11 hrs (2012-09-16 05:37:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Answer to asker (take 2):
Sure, I see what you mean: target audience isn't relevant here.
I meant to say that it would matter in a case different than this one.
Thanks!

Selected response from:

Jostrans (X)
Canada
Local time: 17:00

Grading comment

Many thanks again for you assurance. In other cases, Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès would have been appropriate.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

4 +3

Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis

Jostrans (X)

(Fédération de) Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (pour l'ONU, en 2012)

Isabelle F. BRUCHER (X)

3 +1

Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès

Alain Boulé

Discussion entries: 1

Answers

5 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

saint kitts and nevis Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès

Explanation:
Sur le site du ministère des affaire étrangères.

http://www.diplomatie.gouv.fr/fr/conseils-aux-voyageurs/cons...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 21 mins (2012-09-15 18:01:38 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Effectivement, sur le site de l'ONU, en français, on trouve
Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis, quel est le problème ?

http://www.un.org/fr/members/#s

Alain Boulé
Local time: 23:00
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 16

Notes to answerer

Asker: Dear Alain: Perhaps I have not phrased the question very well, but the document is VERY, VERY UN-specific. The UN uses: Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis according to the link I included when originally posted: The document is from: UNITED NATIONS WORKING PAPER GROUP OF EXPERTS NO. 54 ON GEOGRAPHICAL NAMES Twenty-sixth session Vienna, 2-6 May 2011 KN SAINT KITTS AND NEVIS Language Short name Formal name National Official en: English Saint Kitts and Nevis Federation of Saint Christopher and Nevis (the) UN Official English Saint Kitts and Nevis Saint Kitts and Nevis **French Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (masc.) Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (masc.)*** I am afraid, what the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of any country uses, it not my question. It relates to what the UN uses (which according to my most updated info is different) and hence my question. Do you know what is official for the "UN"? Thank you.

Asker: Alain. Thank you. There is no problem at my end. I believe I was very specific in my initial request (and you did not initially give me the guidance I was seeking). Be that as it may, it is now solved. Again, thank you for taking valuable time out of your schedule to share your thoughts. It is appreciated.

23 mins confidence:

saint kitts and nevis (Fédération de) Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (pour l'ONU, en 2012)

Explanation:
1) IATE.EUROPA.EU: (source: Union européenne)

http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc... /

"Terme Saint-Christophe-et-Nevis
Fiabilité 4 (très fiable)
Réf. du terme Code de rédaction interinstitutionnel, Annexe 5, Office des publications, 9.3.2005, http://publications.europa.e...
Usage L'article 1er de la constitution de cet État dispose que celui-ci peut être dénommé "Saint Christopher and Nevis or St Kitts and Nevis or the Federation of Saint Christopher and Nevis or the Federation of St Kitts and Nevis". Aux autres articles de la Constitution, l'Etat est chaque fois dénommé "Saint Christopher and Nevis".
Date 28/10/2008 "

---
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc... :

"Terme Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis
Fiabilité 2 (fiabilité minimale)

Usage ****L'orthographe française ci-dessus, mentionnée dans le Petit Larousse 1996, est celle en usage à l'ONU et au FMI.****

On trouve également St Kitts et Nevis, ou encore St-Christophe et Niévès ou St-Christophe-et-Niéves.

A noter que l'anglais "Nevis" reprend le mot espagnol "nieves", nom donné par les premiers explorateurs à cette île en raison des nuages qui entouraient son point culminant.

A seule fin d'uniformité, il est recommandé de s'en tenir à l'orthographe de l'entrée française.

Commentaire relatif au terme Membre de l'OECO. État insulaire des Antilles. Capitale : Basseterre (sur l'île de Saint-Kitts) . Monnaie : dollar des Caraïbes orientales ou XCD.
Date 28/09/2004

Source: EIB IATE ID: 2191874"

---
2) WIKIPEDIA:

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint-Christophe-et-Nevis#cite_... :

"Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès, en forme longue la Fédération de Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès, en forme aussi bien longue que courte Saint-Christophe-et-Nevis ***ou Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis [3]***, en anglais Saint Kitts and Nevis et Federation of Saint Kitts and Nevis (prononcer [seɪnt ˌkɪts ænd ˈniːvɪs]), est un État situé dans les petites Antilles, composé des îles Saint-Christophe et Niévès, associées sous la forme d'une fédération."

"[3] ↑ L'arrêté français du 4 novembre 1993 relatif à la terminologie des noms d'États et de capitales retient la graphie « Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès » tandis que l'Office des publications de l’Union européenne choisit la graphie « Saint-Christophe-et-Nevis » dans son code de rédaction interinstitutionnel [archive]. Le Canada a retenu la graphie « Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis » (noms de pays en français retenus par le ministère des Affaires étrangères et du Commerce international du Canada [archive])."

---
3) TERMIUM:

http://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-fra.html?la... :

"OBS – Fédération de Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis : nom officiel reconnu aux Nations Unies."

----
=> Toutes les sources concordent et s'accordent à dire qu'à l'ONU, on dit bien (encore et toujours maintenant) "(Fédération de) Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis".

Vous aviez la réponse mais vouliez une confirmation de l'actualité du terme.

Il fallait donc consulter plusieurs sources...

Isabelle F. BRUCHER (X)
Belgium
Local time: 23:00
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 4

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you Isabelle. Very useful information (although I had seen the wikipedia entry prior to posting) and others. However, I hope you will not be "mad" but in all fairness "Jostrans" submitted his rationale first and it was exactly the assurance I sought. The target audience does not matter as the document is very UN-specific (in other words, the assurance I sought is what is used throughout the entire UN system). Thanks again for taking valuable time out of your schedule to assure me.

9 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +3

saint kitts and nevis

Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis

Jostrans (X)
Canada
Local time: 17:00
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 8

Grading comment

Many thanks again for you assurance. In other cases, Saint-Christophe-et-Niévès would have been appropriate.

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you Jostrans. This is the assurance I was seeking. I wanted to ensure that I was using the most current information. Again, thank you and regards.

Asker: Jostrans: Again thank you. The question is not what the target public is but what the UN's current norm is. Having said that, your answer was the first "correct" answer to my specific question (before Alain or Isabelle). I will wait the 24 hrs. required time and then grade. Again, your time is appreciated as well as your assurance. Many thanks.

Asker: Dear Jostrans: I agree Alain's answer isn't wrong (under normal circumstances, but not used by the UN) and I did not say it was wrong! I explained before that the target audience is neither here nor there (the target audience is not merely French speaking, but others too). I reiterate the target audience is not relevant here. Thanks again for your personal help.

Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

Return to KudoZ list

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.

See also:

ProZ.com term search

Search millions of term translations

Saint Kitts and Nevis

French translation: Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (UN context)

Answers

KudoZ™ translation help

Your current localization setting

Select a language

Saint Kitts and Nevis

French translation: Saint-Kitts-et-Nevis (UN context)

Answers

KudoZ™ translation help

You have native languages that can be verified

Your current localization setting

Select a language