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Villa de realengo

inglés translation: town of the royal demesne / town under royal jurisdiction

Entrada de glosario (tomada de la pregunta de abajo)
Término o frase en español:Villa de realengo
Traducción al inglés:town of the royal demesne / town under royal jurisdiction
Aportado por: broca

10:24 Apr 26, 2017
Traducciones de español a inglés [PRO]
Social Sciences - Historia
Término o frase en español: Villa de realengo
ESCRITURAS Y CONCEJO: ÉCIJA, UNA VILLA DE REALENGO EN LA FRONTERA (1263-1400)
http://editorial.us.es/detalle-de-libro/719704/escrituras-y-...
broca
Local time: 18:08
town of the royal demesne / town under royal jurisdiction
Explicación:
Ana is right; a villa de realengo was a town belonging to the Crown. To be more exact, it was a town under the direct jurisdiction of the crown. Wikipedia is accurate here:

"Realengo es la calificación jurisdiccional que tienen los lugares dependientes directamente del rey, es decir, cuyo señor jurisdiccional es el mismo rey. Se utiliza como término opuesto a señorío."
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realengo

However, though I don't want to seem picky, I feel that "belonging to the Crown" doesn't make for a very good title. The "town/crown" rhyme is unfortunate. You'd have "a frontier town belonging to the Crown". "A town on the frontier belonging to the Crown" would perhaps sound better from this point of view, but I still don't find it very well expressed. And as I say, "belonging" is basically correct, but a bit loose, since the real question is direct royal jurisdiction; "held by the Crown" would be more accurate, strictly speaking.

I would suggest that in a feudal context like this the historical English term "royal demesne" could be used:

"Demesne of the crown, or royal demesne, was that part of the crown lands not granted to feudal tenants but managed by crown stewards"
https://global.britannica.com/topic/demesne

"In England royal demesne is the land held by the Crown, and ancient demesne is the legal term for the land held by the king at the time of the Domesday Book."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demesne

You could say "a town on royal demesne", as Evelyn Proctor does referring to Mayorga in the twelfth century:
https://books.google.es/books?id=KawpwKsRy70C&pg=PA65&lpg=PA...

Or "a town of the royal demesne":

"Authentic history dawns upon it in the twelfth century, when it was a town of the royal demesne"
https://books.google.es/books?id=2c1JAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA730&lpg=P...

Alternatively, if you prefer something more neutral and less technical-sounding, simply "under royal jurisdiction".

I think "a frontier town of the royal demesne" or "a frontier town under royal jurisdiction" would sound OK.
Respuesta elegida de:

Charles Davis
España
Local time: 18:08
Grading comment
Thanks
4 puntos KudoZ otorgados a esta respuesta



Resumen de las respuestas recibidas
4 +2town of the royal demesne / town under royal jurisdiction
Charles Davis
3 +1town belonging to the Crown
Ana Vozone
Summary of reference entries provided
Burgh or borough...
neilmac

  

Respuestas


17 minutos   Nivel de confianza: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 Coincidencias de otros usuarios (netas) +1
town belonging to the Crown


Explicación:
https://www.google.pt/search?q="town belonging to the crown"...

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/other/186437-re...

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish_to_english/history/4282418...

Ejemplos de uso:
  • it with Valencia de Alcantara and a year later Caceres was granted the title of city, until then having been a villa de realengo (town belonging to the Crown).
Ana Vozone
Local time: 17:08
Idioma materno: portugués
Pts. PRO en la categoría: 8

Comentarios de otros usuarios sobre esta respuesta (y réplicas del usuario que envió la respuesta)
Coincido  neilmac: I still think this is the best option so far, despite any comments to the contrary.
53 minutos
  -> Thank you, Neil!
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1 hora   Nivel de confianza: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 Coincidencias de otros usuarios (netas) +2
town of the royal demesne / town under royal jurisdiction


Explicación:
Ana is right; a villa de realengo was a town belonging to the Crown. To be more exact, it was a town under the direct jurisdiction of the crown. Wikipedia is accurate here:

"Realengo es la calificación jurisdiccional que tienen los lugares dependientes directamente del rey, es decir, cuyo señor jurisdiccional es el mismo rey. Se utiliza como término opuesto a señorío."
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realengo

However, though I don't want to seem picky, I feel that "belonging to the Crown" doesn't make for a very good title. The "town/crown" rhyme is unfortunate. You'd have "a frontier town belonging to the Crown". "A town on the frontier belonging to the Crown" would perhaps sound better from this point of view, but I still don't find it very well expressed. And as I say, "belonging" is basically correct, but a bit loose, since the real question is direct royal jurisdiction; "held by the Crown" would be more accurate, strictly speaking.

I would suggest that in a feudal context like this the historical English term "royal demesne" could be used:

"Demesne of the crown, or royal demesne, was that part of the crown lands not granted to feudal tenants but managed by crown stewards"
https://global.britannica.com/topic/demesne

"In England royal demesne is the land held by the Crown, and ancient demesne is the legal term for the land held by the king at the time of the Domesday Book."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demesne

You could say "a town on royal demesne", as Evelyn Proctor does referring to Mayorga in the twelfth century:
https://books.google.es/books?id=KawpwKsRy70C&pg=PA65&lpg=PA...

Or "a town of the royal demesne":

"Authentic history dawns upon it in the twelfth century, when it was a town of the royal demesne"
https://books.google.es/books?id=2c1JAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA730&lpg=P...

Alternatively, if you prefer something more neutral and less technical-sounding, simply "under royal jurisdiction".

I think "a frontier town of the royal demesne" or "a frontier town under royal jurisdiction" would sound OK.

Charles Davis
España
Local time: 18:08
Se especializa en este campo
Idioma materno: inglés
Pts. PRO en la categoría: 312
Grading comment
Thanks

Comentarios de otros usuarios sobre esta respuesta (y réplicas del usuario que envió la respuesta)
Coincido  James A. Walsh: Both options sound great as titles, although personally I would probably opt for the less technical-sounding one, as it's instantly understandable, whereas the other one may not be.
1 hora
  -> Thanks a lot, James :-)

Coincido  Robert Carter: Yes, patronage is obviously a quite different concept to jurisdiction, particularly in a feudal context.
4 horas
  -> Thanks, Robert. I would say so, yes.
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Reference comments


1 hora
Reference: Burgh or borough...

Reference information:
This sounded like a "royal burgh" to me, but when I researched it a bit it seems to only be "a thing" in Scotland, where the best-known one would be Edinburgh.

The English equivalent would be royal borough:
https://www.rbkc.gov.uk/

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2017-04-26 14:43:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

@Charles, in fact "patronage" sounds like a euphemism for "rule"...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2017-04-26 14:45:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

PS: And I didn't post this as an answer, simply as a "Cf." (i.e. something to compare with the solutions already suggested).


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_burgh
    Referencia: http://www.dictionary.com/browse/royal-burgh
neilmac
España
Idioma materno: inglés
Pts. PRO en la categoría: 40

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
Neutral  Charles Davis: No, it's quite different from a royal borough, which means a town/city under royal patronage. Realengo means under royal jurisdiction.
15 minutos
  -> if you like, but I really don't see much difference between "jurisdiction/patronage" at the end of the day. To me, they're much of a muchness...
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