a la sombra de españoles

English translation: in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

Spanish term or phrase:	a la sombra de españoles
English translation:	in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards
Entered by:	Carmen Schultz

04:27 Dec 2, 2009

Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - History / Old documents; 18th century Spanish colonial trade

Spanish term or phrase: a la sombra de españoles

From an article about trade between Spain and Peru in the late 18th century. The phrase is from a letter written to the king in 1779.

Lógicamente el representante del Consulado de Lima en Madrid se mostró en profundo desacuerdo con la idea de reciprocidad que manejaban los gaditanos, afirmando que el juramento debía dirigierse únicamente a
"evitar no vayan a Yndias efectos de estrangeros **a la sombre de españoles**", pero que el Consulado de Cádiz, en contra de lo dispuesto por la Real Cédula de 1749, utilizaba dicho juramento para excluir a los peruanos del comercio de comisión.

The merchant guilds of Lima and Cádiz are arguing about who gets to actually sell merchandise that is shipped to Peru and other American markets. The oath referred to was designed to make sure that control of the merchandise stayed with the Spanish agents traveling with the goods from Cádiz. Lima disputes that, and in the quotation insists that the oath should be used only to make sure that pure-blooded Spaniards and not jenízaros (Spaniards of mixed parentage) or foreigners be allowed to trade with Spanish colonies in the Americas.

Whew! The question is just how to translate "a la sombra de españoles," but without all this background, it would be easy to misinterpret the point of the statement.

"Under the protection of Spaniards"?
"in the guise of Spaniards"?
"unnoticed among the Spaniards"?
the ambiguous "under/in the shadow of Spaniards"?

My translation of the quotation, at the moment, is: "preventing from going to the Yndies effects of foreyners in the shadow of Spaniards."

Any help, both in interpreting the original and in expressing it in English, will be greatly appreciated.

JaneTranslates KudoZ activity Questions: 152 (none open) (4 closed without grading) Answers: 505 Puerto Rico
Local time: 10:11

in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

Explanation:
I would opt for the first one using shadows and in the guise as a second option

Selected response from:

Carmen Schultz
Local time: 09:11

Grading comment

Thanks, Carmen! I think I'd be wisest to stick to the ambiguity of the literal translation. Maybe I've been overthinking this?
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

on the coattails of the Spaniards

patinba

to the detriment of the Spanish

David Hollywood

under the Spanish umbrella /umbrella of Spain

David Ronder

following the Spaniards path/disguised in the Spaniards path

Anne Smith Campbell

in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

Carmen Schultz

Discussion entries: 2

Answers

1 hr confidence:

following the Spaniards path/disguised in the Spaniards path

Explanation:
Just a couple of ideas as I understand "sombra" in this context as the "path"... already opened by the Spaniards.

Best of luck!

Anne Smith Campbell
Spain
Local time: 16:11
Native speaker of:

Spanish,

English

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you, Anne. I like your idea, but I've decided to go with the literal translation.

2 hrs confidence:

in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

Explanation:
I would opt for the first one using shadows and in the guise as a second option

Carmen Schultz
Local time: 09:11
Native speaker of:

Spanish,

English
PRO pts in category: 8

Grading comment

Thanks, Carmen! I think I'd be wisest to stick to the ambiguity of the literal translation. Maybe I've been overthinking this?

7 hrs confidence:

on the coattails of the Spaniards

Explanation:
if you want an equivalent English idiom
Idiom:
on the coattails of
1. As a result of the success of another

patinba
Argentina
Local time: 11:11
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 105

Notes to answerer

Asker: In regular text I would be very tempted to use this one. However, since it's a historical quote, I've decided to stick with the literal. Thanks for your excellent suggestion.

3 mins confidence:

to the detriment of the Spanish

Explanation:
I would suggest ...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 hrs (2009-12-02 20:37:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

this is a free translation and takes a fair bit of licence with the original but I still think it's justified ... will depend on how free you can afford to be with your rendering ...

David Hollywood
Local time: 11:11
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 68

Notes to answerer

Asker: I like it, David. It says what I think is meant. But--can you really get "to the detriment" out of "a la sombra"?

Asker: Call me a coward, but I really don't think I can afford this much freedom. Thanks very much, David.

5 hrs confidence:

under the Spanish umbrella /umbrella of Spain

Explanation:
That's how I read it, and the origin of the word is of course the same as 'sombra':

'The word umbrella is from the Latin word umbra, which in turn derives from the Ancient Greek ómbros (όμβρος). Its meaning is shade or shadow.' (Wikipedia).

There are plenty of historical hits for both 'under the Spanish umbrella' and 'under the umbrella of Spain' - e.g. :

[PDF] Saturday, March 25, 2006 8:45–10:15 AM Date: Saturday, March 25 ...File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
families, the Colonna, were brought under the Spanish umbrella through marriage, titles, and military service between 1500 and 1520, and ultimately became ...
www.rsa.org/pdfs/2006/2006tentiveprogramSAT.pdf

Most important event in history [Archive] - Straight Dope Message ...The world could easily have become Spanish-ruled if Brit colonies in North America were under the Spanish umbrella as well as all of South America. ...
boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-229432.html

Bambooweb: MadridCarlos III would be one of the most popular kings in the history of Madrid, ... considered as European regions, under the umbrella of Spain. ...
www.bambooweb.com/articles/m/a/Madrid.html - Cached

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Note added at 5 days (2009-12-07 10:35:18 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Yes, Jane, it probably is anachronistic for a primary source, but I felt it did express the idea and was pleased with the wordplay. I think it's sensible of you here to go with the most literal suggestion.

David Ronder
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:11
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 52

Notes to answerer

Asker: I love the wordplay, David! But I think it sounds too modern, and also too "interpreted"--I'm sticking to the literal, after all. Thanks so much for an interesting suggestion!

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a la sombra de españoles

English translation: in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

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a la sombra de españoles

English translation: in the shadow of the Spaniards ; in the guise of Spaniards

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