aliunde perceptum

English translation: earnings from other work (in the meantime)

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Italian term or phrase:aliunde perceptum
English translation:earnings from other work (in the meantime)
Entered by: Joanna M Cas (X)

18:05 Jun 23, 2008
Italian to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
Italian term or phrase: aliunde perceptum
The claimant is claiming a number of sums of money, 'detratto l’aliunde perceptum'. It would seem to mean (from what I found on the web, quoted below) what you earned after you were dismissed - you have to give credit for this when calculating damages for unlawful dismissal.



'Per completezza va evidenziato anche che la natura risarcitoria della tutela di cui si può giovare il lavoratore comporta inoltre la rilevanza, in senso riduttivo del danno, delle retribuzioni percepite dal lavoratore sulla base di occupazioni conseguite successivamente al licenziamento: il c.d. aliunde perceptum (Corte Cass., Sez. L, Sent. n. 3345 del 21.3.2000).'

I know we should leave latin in latin, but this is not a recognised and used phrase in English employment law and I would like to know how anyone else has decided to deal with it.
Joanna M Cas (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:14
earnings from other sources/sums earned elsewhere
Explanation:
that's the literal sense of the Latin, which I would translate in this case. Of course, there may be a more elegant (or legally correct) way of putting it...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2008-06-24 08:08:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

as for leaving Latin in Latin, I'm not sure it's always the best option; Italian legal language does not necessarily use more Latin than English, but different expressions have stood the test of time in the two systems, and often have different origins. Just because we use a Latin expression in English, this does not necessarily mean (and often doesn't) that it is used or understood in Italy, and vice versa. Latin expressions used in Italian Law may derive from Justinian or elsewhere; in English Law they often derive from Medieval legal texts drafted directly in Latin. For example, the Italians don't use 'habeas corpus' or 'subpoena'. Conversely, the Italians often use 'ope legis', which is extremely rare in English texts. There are obviously many more such cases.
Habeas corpus is actually a good illustration of how the two systems use 'different' Latin: law in England at the time of its introduction was drafted in Latin, but this does not imply any derivation from Roman Law, and in fact habeas corpus is a quintessentially Common Law concept.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day20 hrs (2008-06-25 14:42:02 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hi Joanna, yes; that's what I meant of course. I think earnings gives that idea (unlike income, for instance, which could include interest on investments), but you could perhaps add some other word to make it clear - professional earnings for example. Hope that helps!
Selected response from:

simon tanner
Italy
Local time: 00:14
Grading comment
in the end I left the Latin phrase in, with an explanation. Thanks all
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +4earnings from other sources/sums earned elsewhere
simon tanner
5aliunde perceptum (percepibile con l'ordinaria diligenza)
Giovanni Pizzati (X)
4Other employment undertaken in the meantime
Gad Kohenov


  

Answers


3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Other employment undertaken in the meantime


Explanation:
ANNUAL REPORT 2005
the plaintiff as a result of other employment undertaken in the meantime (so-called
aliunde perceptum). Certain rulings continue to consider the employment ...
www.poste.it/en/azienda/chi_siamo/annual_report_2005.pdf - Similar pages


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2008-06-23 21:09:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Aliunde perceptum with the English between parentheses.

Gad Kohenov
Israel
Local time: 01:14
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in HebrewHebrew
PRO pts in category: 394
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

49 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +4
earnings from other sources/sums earned elsewhere


Explanation:
that's the literal sense of the Latin, which I would translate in this case. Of course, there may be a more elegant (or legally correct) way of putting it...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2008-06-24 08:08:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

as for leaving Latin in Latin, I'm not sure it's always the best option; Italian legal language does not necessarily use more Latin than English, but different expressions have stood the test of time in the two systems, and often have different origins. Just because we use a Latin expression in English, this does not necessarily mean (and often doesn't) that it is used or understood in Italy, and vice versa. Latin expressions used in Italian Law may derive from Justinian or elsewhere; in English Law they often derive from Medieval legal texts drafted directly in Latin. For example, the Italians don't use 'habeas corpus' or 'subpoena'. Conversely, the Italians often use 'ope legis', which is extremely rare in English texts. There are obviously many more such cases.
Habeas corpus is actually a good illustration of how the two systems use 'different' Latin: law in England at the time of its introduction was drafted in Latin, but this does not imply any derivation from Roman Law, and in fact habeas corpus is a quintessentially Common Law concept.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day20 hrs (2008-06-25 14:42:02 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hi Joanna, yes; that's what I meant of course. I think earnings gives that idea (unlike income, for instance, which could include interest on investments), but you could perhaps add some other word to make it clear - professional earnings for example. Hope that helps!

simon tanner
Italy
Local time: 00:14
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 751
Grading comment
in the end I left the Latin phrase in, with an explanation. Thanks all
Notes to answerer
Asker: hear what you say regarding literal meaning, but this would mean earnings from anywhere- eg interest on savings. I think the practical effect is (in fact as it would be under Eng law too) - what did you earn working elsewhere after we sacked you?


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  grazy73
1 hr
  -> thanks grazy

agree  Pompeo Lattanzi
2 hrs
  -> thanks Pompeo

agree  Peter Cox
10 hrs
  -> thanks Peter

agree  Valeria Lattanzi
14 hrs
  -> thanks Valeria
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

27 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
aliunde perceptum (percepibile con l'ordinaria diligenza)


Explanation:
aliunde perceptum. o percepibile con l'ordinaria diligenza
lascialo intradotto con traduzione tra parentesi.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 29 min (2008-06-23 18:34:18 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

http://www.fondazioneforense.it/upload/s755_03LMO.pdf

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 giorni (2008-07-04 10:25:46 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

o percepito da altra fonte

Giovanni Pizzati (X)
Italy
Local time: 00:14
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 257
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.


See also:
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search