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an die Gestalt von Melisbroden

English translation: in the form of sugar loaves

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
German term or phrase:an die Gestalt von Melisbroden
English translation:in the form of sugar loaves
Entered by: Ann C Sherwin

16:53 Jan 21, 2006
German to English translations [PRO]
Wine / Oenology / Viticulture / 19th century
German term or phrase: an die Gestalt von Melisbroden
Context is a hand-copied passage from an 1864 book on winemaking:
Wendet man Rohrzucker **an die Gestalt von Melisbroden**,
so hat man überall 1/6 weniger als Traubenzucker zu
gebrauchen, um einen gleichen Alkoholgehalt zu erreichen.

With Google I got a hit suggesting that Melisbroden is an inferior type of sugar. That makes sense, but in place of "an die Gestalt" I would have expected something like "anstatt." Is this likely a case of miscopying? I am thinking of saying "rather than an inferior sugar..."
Ann C Sherwin
Local time: 11:21
in the form of
Explanation:
if you read "an die Gestalt von" as "in der Gestalt von"

But I'm only just guessing too, perhaps you should try it before you publish the recipe ;-)

PS mel(is) = honey, in Latin? so this part may refer to stickyness
Selected response from:

Ricki Farn
Germany
Local time: 17:21
Grading comment
I found this in the old dictionary Jonathan cited: "Melis war erst der Nahme eines feinen Zuckers aus Malta, Saccharum Melitense. Jetzt bedeutet es eine Art raffinirter Brote, die wieder ihre Eintheilungen hat."
Elsewhere I found references to Zuckerbrot as a synonym for Zuckerhut. So it was actually my original misunderstanding of Melisbroden that got me off track. You got me back on, and I agree with your hunch that "an die Gestalt von" should have been "in der Gestalt von." There were a many other copying errors in this document, so it's not surprising. I thank both you and Jonathan for your help.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
1 +1in the form of sugar of lesser quality
Jonathan MacKerron
2in the form of
Ricki Farn


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5 peer agreement (net): +1
in the form of sugar of lesser quality


Explanation:
my guess based on several google hits
Duden for Melis =weißer Zucker verschiedener Zuckersorten. A cognate for molasses I should think.


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Note added at 1 hr (2006-01-21 18:35:13 GMT)
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1897 Muret-Sanders for Meliszucker = "(coarse) loaf sugar)"
for Melis = "It. saccharum melitense)"


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Note added at 1 hr (2006-01-21 18:38:42 GMT)
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also "loaf sugar" in several other ancient dictionaries

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Note added at 1 hr (2006-01-21 18:41:44 GMT)
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yes, as Ricki suggests "instead of Melisbroden"
found Broden in Flügler's 1893 dictionary = "crumbs, bits, scraps, lumps"

Jonathan MacKerron
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 19

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Ricki Farn: ... // but I didn't mean "instead of" - I meant "if you use cane sugar in the form of Melisbroden, then you must use 1/6 less than when using glucose" (perhaps the gooey cheaper sugar produces more alcohol than pure glucose)
6 mins
  -> so you're saying that "an die Gestalt von" means "in the form of" here? I'm was just guessing anyway...
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
in the form of


Explanation:
if you read "an die Gestalt von" as "in der Gestalt von"

But I'm only just guessing too, perhaps you should try it before you publish the recipe ;-)

PS mel(is) = honey, in Latin? so this part may refer to stickyness

Ricki Farn
Germany
Local time: 17:21
Native speaker of: German
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
I found this in the old dictionary Jonathan cited: "Melis war erst der Nahme eines feinen Zuckers aus Malta, Saccharum Melitense. Jetzt bedeutet es eine Art raffinirter Brote, die wieder ihre Eintheilungen hat."
Elsewhere I found references to Zuckerbrot as a synonym for Zuckerhut. So it was actually my original misunderstanding of Melisbroden that got me off track. You got me back on, and I agree with your hunch that "an die Gestalt von" should have been "in der Gestalt von." There were a many other copying errors in this document, so it's not surprising. I thank both you and Jonathan for your help.
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