mit seinem finsteren Gesellen

English translation: with his grim companion

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

German term or phrase:	mit seinem finsteren Gesellen
English translation:	with his grim companion
Entered by:	warren

21:31 Dec 4, 2010

German to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature

German term or phrase: mit seinem finsteren Gesellen

Der Weihnachtsmann war damals noch nicht so populär hat er doch bei uns als Nikolaus mit seinem finsteren Gesellen und der Rute schon vorher vorbei geschaut.

warren KudoZ activity Questions: 8 (none open) Answers: 20
Local time: 02:06

with his grim companion

Explanation:
Finster, in this context, refers to the attitude of that person, someone who is grim, untrustworthy, highly obscure.

Selected response from:

Thayenga
Germany
Local time: 02:06

Grading comment

Thanks again for your input and that of everyone else. This is the choice of the author of the piece I am translating and after studying all the references I think it is a good choice.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

4 +6

with his dark companion

Lynda Hepburn

3 +5

with his grim companion

Thayenga

with his companion

markuslebt

with his ominous colleague

Frosty

Summary of reference entries provided

Info

Kim Metzger

Krampus

Johanna Timm, PhD

Discussion entries: 6

Answers

20 mins confidence:

with his companion

Explanation:
Santa Claus wasn´t that popular back in the days, for he had already paid us a visit sometimes with his birching rod and his sinister companion.

markuslebt
Local time: 02:06
Native speaker of:

English,

German

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks Markus

43 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +6

with his dark companion

Explanation:
St. Nicholas is accompanied by "black Peter" in some European countries. See under "Black Peter" in the reference below.

Example sentence(s):

Black Peter Comes with St. Nicholas, mostly in the Netherlands...

Reference: http://www.stnicholascenter.org/Brix?pageID=205

Lynda Hepburn
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:06
Native speaker of: English

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks Lynda

56 mins confidence:

with his ominous colleague

Explanation:
The ominous colleague is none other than the (usually dark-clothed and masked) "Knecht Ruprecht" - the one bearing the Rute (birch-twigs).

In the strict German version (and French - I first saw the Ruprecht element in Elsace), before handing out any presents Nikolaus checks his conduct book for any misdemeanours committed by the child during the past year. If any are recorded, then instead of presents the child (theoretically!) gets a bit of a thrashing - by Ruprecht and with his rute.

This element was not adopted in the Anglo-Saxon version of Nikolaus/Santa Claus.

Frosty
Local time: 02:06
Works in field
Native speaker of: English

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks Frosty

9 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +5

with his grim companion

Explanation:
Finster, in this context, refers to the attitude of that person, someone who is grim, untrustworthy, highly obscure.

Thayenga
Germany
Local time: 02:06
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

German
PRO pts in category: 8

Grading comment

Thanks again for your input and that of everyone else. This is the choice of the author of the piece I am translating and after studying all the references I think it is a good choice.

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you for your feedbackThayenga

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Edwin Miles: I like grim, too. It conveys the nature of the companion better than "dark". And when I think of Knecht Ruprecht, he wears black/brown and might have a dirty/sooty face, but is not a black man.

1 hr

-> Yes, indeed, he was a grim character. Thank you, Edwin. Happy Sunday.

agree

inkweaver: "Grim" or "sinister" would have been my suggestions since "finster" refers to a character trait here, IMHO, not to the colour of Knecht Ruprecht's skin.

3 hrs

-> Exactly. I like sinister, too. Thank you, inkweaver. Happy Sunday.

agree

Ramey Rieger (X): I like grim, but think "shady" refers to his unpredictability. sort of a "mad dog" kind of guy.

3 hrs

-> Shady is good, too. And he sure was an unpredictable fellow. Thank you, unis. Enjoy your Sunday.

agree

Nicola Wood: I like this as it is appropriate to all the possible companions (Knecht Ruprecht, Black Peter or Krampus) all of whom perform a similar grim function and have a similar grim character, but not all of whom are black or dark..

3 hrs

-> Yes, this "finster" has nothing to do with skin color. Thank you, Nicola. Happy Sunday.

agree

seehand

1 day 1 hr

-> Thank you. :)

Reference comments

51 mins

Reference: Info

Reference information:
And his companion, (Squire) Ruprecht

The adherents of the Catholic Counterreformation did not quietly accept the diminishment of their saint. They responded to the practices of the unorthodox Protestants by making Nicholas a figure who visited families' homes on his appointed day and stood in judgment over children. If the young ones could answer religious questions and said their bedtime prayers faithfully, they received a gift from the sack that Nicholas' companion, Knecht Ruprecht, had slung over his shoulder. Those that slacked in their religious commitments got the switch or were threatened with being hauled off in Ruprecht's sack.
Today children in all the German-speaking regions, regardless of religious denomination, celebrate Nicholastag. Ruprecht, who typically carries a basket filled with edible goodies for the children (and also the switches for the naughty children), has become Nicholas' constant companion. In German-speaking Switzerland, Ruprecht is known as Schmutzli.

http://www.vistawide.com/german/christmas/german_christmas_t...

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/german_to_english/marketing_market...

Kim Metzger
Mexico
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 213

Note to reference poster

Asker: Thanks you Sir

2 hrs

Reference: Krampus

Reference information:
paganwiccan.about.com/od/yuletraditions/p/Krampusnacht.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2010-12-04 23:50:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

http://paganwiccan.about.com/od/yuletraditions/p/Krampusnach...

Johanna Timm, PhD
Canada
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

German
PRO pts in category: 69

Note to reference poster

Asker: Thank you Johanna

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mit seinem finsteren Gesellen

English translation: with his grim companion

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