| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | 500 word test translation--too long? Thread poster: Whitney Maslak
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Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | Sounds familiar... | Aug 31, 2015 |
Gabriele Demuth wrote:
This is the question. I have been advised here and made this experience myself: the more time an agency asks you to invest before they give you the first job, the lower the rate they are prepared to pay and the less they respect you.
E.g. on one occasion, after clearly having stated my rates, I spent quite a bit of time on a test translation, constant communication for days, signing forms and contracts, signing on to their platform, familiarising myself with their CAT tool and agreeing to using it - and then they told me that they will pay me US0.05 per word!
I was quite annoyed, they did agree to my rate in the end but I never heard from them again.
This really is so similar to what I've been dealing with. There have been quite a few emails back and forth, I had to fill out a survey stating what kind of services I provided and what my working fields were (which I don't mind, but it sort of makes me think that sending them my CV was a waste of time...), then signing a lengthy NDA...which again, I don't mind that at all, but it's a lot of time to put in when I don't have a guarantee of work and they haven't agreed to my rates.
I just emailed back and said I'd do the test if they pay me at my regular rate. I'm sure they won't like that, but it'll be interesting to see what they say. I guess if I was really desperate for work I would consider doing it, but I just don't like giving my work away and/or working for almost nothing.
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | That's what it sounds like... | Aug 31, 2015 |
Sheila Wilson wrote: They don't seem to be brilliant potential partners. In fact, I'm wondering if they're one of the enormous multi-nationals. Those have such immense volumes of work to hand out that many freelancers think they're gods. They don't stop to think that they could do better with several smaller clients than being a faceless supplier to one of these corporate giants. But maybe that isn't what you're dealing with here  .
I think you're right, Sheila. The more I converse with them, the less excited I am to work for them. I'm really not expecting to get any work from them at this point (they probably think I'm much too difficult now, haha), but I figure that this is a good experience for me.
| | | | Michael Newton 
United States
Local time: 03:55
Japanese to English
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Tell them you'll be glad to do the 500-word test but you are terribly busy now and can do it two weeks from now.
You will never hear from them again.
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | Haven't heard back | Sep 1, 2015 |
..and I probably won't, because I told them I would be happy to do the 500-word test if they pay me at my regular rate. I figure that it's really not a huge loss.
I think that it's becoming more and more common for people to expect to receive free work from people in freelance industries. I just hope that enough of us will have the self-respect to put our foot down and demand a little better treatment than that.
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Whitney Maslak wrote:
I think that it's becoming more and more common for people to expect to receive free work from people in freelance industries. I just hope that enough of us will have the self-respect to put our foot down and demand a little better treatment than that.
500 words probably is too long. I think if an agency is competent, it should be able to select a short text (max. 300 words) that shows them how well a translator can work.
I haven't done many tests: the few I have done have been unpaid, although I was paid for one the other day! I see it's becoming more common; to be fair, however, it's a trend that goes hand in hand with the huge influx of incompetent translators flooding the market. Anyone can claim to be able to do any number of things, or write anything they want on their profile. I could claim to be a nuclear scientist; getting me to do a test would show the agency I wasn't, without the headache of finding someone who was actually competent once the job had been assigned.
I think for the most part, tests are an agency's way of protecting themselves, and I don't really blame them!
As for your question - is 500 words too long? Probably, but it's really a call only you can make. Is it any agency you want to work with? How busy are you at the moment? How good is the potential ROI? And so on.
[Edited at 2015-09-01 13:54 GMT]
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:55
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| As Fiona says, depends on the context | Sep 1, 2015 |
Fiona Grace Peterson wrote:
As for your question - is 500 words too long? Probably, but it's really a call only you can make. Is it any agency you want to work with? How busy are you at the moment? How good is the potential ROI? And so on.
I regard tests as a positive - they keep me on my toes - but I tell people my rates up-front and I don't do more than the equivalent of 300 words unless there are other factors involved.
One agency wanted to me to do three slightly different tests of more than 500 words each for one specialization (finance). Then they wondered why I was reluctant!
Regards
Dan
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | Why not test every professional in every industry? | Sep 1, 2015 |
I guess I just see the whole concept of tests as a strange way of proving your competence as a freelancer. If you were applying for a job and your potential employer wanted to test you in some way, that would be more reasonable. But I just don't think it's acceptable for freelancers to be treated that way.
Let me put it this way...I am getting a new roof on my house this month. I have never worked with this roofer before, but I have heard good things about him, so that's why I deci... See more I guess I just see the whole concept of tests as a strange way of proving your competence as a freelancer. If you were applying for a job and your potential employer wanted to test you in some way, that would be more reasonable. But I just don't think it's acceptable for freelancers to be treated that way.
Let me put it this way...I am getting a new roof on my house this month. I have never worked with this roofer before, but I have heard good things about him, so that's why I decided to hire him. Should I insist that he do a small portion of my roof for free first so I can make sure that he does a good job? ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Problem is... | Sep 1, 2015 |
...you tell them your rates. You take and pass the test, they like your translation and want you to work for them - if you agree to their rates.
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Whitney Maslak wrote:
But I just don't think it's acceptable for freelancers to be treated that way.
Did you read my post? In any case it seems you have strong ideas on the subject, which makes me wonder why you started this thread in the first place. Bear in mind too that you cannot be treated that way - no-one forces you to do these tests. If you do one and you object to doing so, you are letting someone treat you that way. There's ALWAYS a choice.
Whitney Maslak wrote:
Let me put it this way...I am getting a new roof on my house this month. I have never worked with this roofer before, but I have heard good things about him, so that's why I decided to hire him. Should I insist that he do a small portion of my roof for free first so I can make sure that he does a good job?
Roofing and translation. Hardly comparable. But you did ask. According to Wikipedia: "Roofers must be able to work, have good motor skills and possess general carpentry skills." I don't think it takes long to become a reasonable roofer - good translation skills take much longer to acquire, encompass a wider range of skills; I don't think I'm wrong when I say that more people are able to acquire roofing skills than translation skills. I don't think there are any degree courses (not that a degree course teaches translation, but you get my point) in roofing, but do correct me if I'm wrong.
Roofing is done by someone on my premises. Which means I can check up on him and the progress of his work. Good luck to you doing the same if you're in Milton Keynes and your Spanish-English translator is in Mexico City. If I hire someone to do my roof and he turns up with van, equipment and helpers, I know he is half way to at least getting the job done, not calling out to passers by every five minutes to help him with Roofing QuerieZ because he's taken on a job outside his specialist area.
"CompetentRoofer is the Government-licenced Competent Person Scheme that allows professional roofing contractors to self-certify that their roof refurbishment work complies with Building Regulations within England and Wales." I think most manual labourers would belong to a similar scheme, which give customers a reasonable guarantee their roof will not leak. Given that translation is an unregulated profession, anyone possessing a PC can can themselves a translator.
So to answer your question, no, I would not ask a roofer to do part of my roof for free; one, because the two professions are not comparable, and two, because roofing, like other trades, has systems in place to protect the customer. That doesn't mean there aren't rogue roofers or cowboys. They're just a bit easier to spot.
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | My comparison to roofing... | Sep 1, 2015 |
...was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. It wasn't really meant to be taken seriously; I guess I should have made that clear.
And I know that no one is forcing me to do a test, I guess it's just somewhat discouraging that it's quite common and expected in our profession, because I think it's a bad practice. But that's just me, and other people are free to do what they want.
| | | | | Plumbers and roofers | Sep 1, 2015 |
I find it tiring that people constantly drag manual workers (usually it's plumbers) into discussions about business practices - they are completely different professions from translation, and I don't think comparing business models is in any way constructive. Translation has become such a unique profession for so many reasons, and I don't think it's helpful to say that tests are ALWAYS bad or ALWAYS good, there are so many factors at play. YOU are the only one in the position to decide where you... See more I find it tiring that people constantly drag manual workers (usually it's plumbers) into discussions about business practices - they are completely different professions from translation, and I don't think comparing business models is in any way constructive. Translation has become such a unique profession for so many reasons, and I don't think it's helpful to say that tests are ALWAYS bad or ALWAYS good, there are so many factors at play. YOU are the only one in the position to decide where you stand on the issue.
All the best. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Whitney Maslak
United States
Local time: 01:55
German to English
TOPIC STARTER
Fiona Grace Peterson wrote:
YOU are the only one in the position to decide where you stand on the issue.
And that's the beauty of freelancing.
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Ylva E
Sweden
Local time: 09:55
French to Swedish
+ ...
| Large tests - 6-8 hours! | Sep 17, 2015 |
What about 6-8 hours test "free of charge"?
It's a large, rich, dominant, global, corporation. I think you know which one...
How many of you have been offered such a test?
How many has actually made the test?
Was it professionally and well evaluated?
I have been offered this test for the second time and I am tempted to turn it down again.
I think we should agree on tests of about 350 words, not more.
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